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Sunday: Borrowing and Spending — 21 Comments

  1. Some continue making excuses while never repaying. They buy new items for themselves and treat you as if you don’t need to be repaid. They’ve graduated to the role of a thief. Thank God for those who borrow and repay as promised.

    (48)
  2. Money is a talent that God gives us for us to manage with wisdom, as every other talent. When we are conscious of it and faithfully give back to Him what already belongs to Him, we may learn how to keep it in balance!

    (14)
  3. It is hard when church members approach me to borrow money and then don't pay back. They assume that my husband and I have money to burn because of our high profession and almost every month someone is asking. I have learnt to say no but I feel bad saying no. However I have realized that since they think we have a lot of money most of them don't keep their promised day of repayments. They won't even say "sorry sis" but I can't pay you anytime soon. What do I do? How do I stop lending without seeming wicked?

    (13)
    • To answer your final sentence, Kemchau, I suggest you try this approach: Evaluate the need and give (instead of lending) as you are able, allowing people to repay as they are able, but not expecting repayment. You will feel better, and they will feel better, and thus you will have better relationships. (Consider Luke 6:38)

      As responsible stewards, there may be times it is better to allow people to suffer the consequences of their poor choices in the management of their affairs, but we must be careful not to judge too harshly, considering that the gift of management is also from God. Especially when the welfare of children is involved, I believe it's better to err on the side of giving too much, rather than too little. (This subject is very close to my heart at the moment because of something going on in my home church.)

      Consider yourselves stewards of God's goods and that He wants to bless His other children through you. I believe that insofar as we possess more blessings than others, whether spiritual or material, we are indebted to them before God, as Paul said, "I am debtor both to the Greeks, and to the Barbarians; both to the wise, and to the unwise." (Ro 1:14) It will take a complete change of mindset for many of us, but I believe that's what it means to be God's "stewards" - i.e. managers of God's possessions.

      (21)
    • Hi Kemchau

      In addition to what Inge has said, your dilemma is complex. There are 3 key issues that appear to be relevant to your situation:

      (a) Why, specifically, do you feel bad/wicked when saying no? What do you believe you are doing wrong and why do you believe it is wrong? (When you have identified these beliefs, compare them with scripture to see whether they are beliefs or, indeed, misbeliefs. If you have difficulty doing that, seek input from a range of trusted people).

      (b) What is happening to the people who are borrowing and not paying back - is it genuinely helping them move forward with how they manage their life/situation, or is it resulting in them being able to continue living 'irresponsibly'? (I don't know the specifics, hence why I am raising the question as a guide for you). The 'loving/beneficent/wise steward' thing to do is to help another person grow and develop. Sometimes that means giving, other times that means not giving - its a situation by situation evaluation.

      (c) As Inge has mentioned, in each case is there a matter of child welfare at stake?

      Hope this helps... Feel free to ask further questions if needed.

      (5)
  4. I am so grateful that in our system we have a court called: "Bankruptcy" I personally thanks God for that remedy.Do anyone know the cost for a simple education. The system is making billions of dollars, while the average human being has to pay the debt. I consider the institution part of the problem. But for the casual listener GOD LOVE YOU.

    (1)
    • I am not sure what you mean in your comment on bankruptcy Tau Esay. Being declared bankrupt has a number of serious consequences and is something that is best avoided. I know that there are circumstances where bankruptcy is necessary. Bankruptcy is not necessarily caused by borrowing more than you can repay. For instance, in cases of accidents where you can be held legally liable and are not covered by insurance, but even in those circumstances, wise planning can reduce the risk.

      Perhaps you could expand on your original comment if you think we can learn from it.

      (3)
      • The purpose of bankruptcy law is to give an overburdened debtor a fresh start by discharging his debts or allowing him to pay them on more favorable terms. Just that simple in the U.S. of A.

        (1)
        • Yes, Tau Esay, it does that. But the notion that it discharges all your debts is not strictly true. And it needs to be said that if your circumstances change and you become solvent again, you still have a moral responsibility to repay those debts. Bankruptcy law is often abused. Having said that I know of people who have become bankrupt through circumstances beyond their control and bankruptcy given them the opportunity to recover.

          (0)
          • Stewardship & Bankruptcy: with respect to bankruptcy (the debtors city of refuge)

            - Careful decision process: yes, some debts are not cancelled once discharged such as taxes, others may be negotiated as acceptable within your local bankruptcy rules/laws such as a vehicle required for commerce.

            Bankruptcy as a "City of Refuge"

            - All "temporal" indebtedness is summed up, petitions are made and judged. Totals are set, affordable payments are made during the bankruptcy period until discharged.

            - Once discharged any payment made afterward towards past debt reopens the account and makes you once again subject to the rules of the organization indebted to, hence you are leaving the city of refuge set up to both protect you "and" teach a valuable stewardship lesson (your personal choice).

            Bankruptcy as Worldly "Grace"

            - Upon discharge the bankrupt carries only insuluable debt or ideally "no" debt.

            - Previous debt is written off by any involved business according to local "bad debt" laws,

            - The bad steward now has a credit record of bankruptcy held for a time (rightfully so) after which and as a consequence of bankruptcy, betrayal of trust takes time to heal and prove change.

            Consequence of Grace and Forgiveness

            - Self imposed and through counselling, new habits of self control have been adopted to become a profitable steward. This is the intent or spirit of the program.

            - The discharged steward has been "forgiven" and is placed under "MORAL" obligation by the provided grace of the program and personal "experience" to not repeat the previous life of poor stewardship.

            Though worldly in policy, "Forgiveness" with typically "no" expectations of repayment (as per closing agreement) is the full intention of this program. The "grace" or sprit under which this program is designed is the correction of both irresponsible stewardship and uncontrollable circumstances.

            Truly understood, this program will invoke an internal response in line with its intent: forgiveness resulting in restitution made by continued responsible stewardship or the correction/mitigation of uncontrollable circumstances.

            The outcome available to the transformed steward is now a "personal" choice to accept the intent of the program, or out of gratitude and "ability" to make restitution.

            What about "MORAL OBLIGATION...?"

            "...he who is forgiven much loves much" ...the intent of the program is no different then the releasing of the slaves or forgiving of debts... The principles align with the intentions, to set at Liberty those that are bound that they might be free to both live and contribute as intended.

            ...He became sin for us that we might be set free in Him we are to have our life and breath... He created us, sought us out, forgave us and redeemed us, why do we find forgiveness such a hard thing to grasp... Let us go back to the cross ... Christ in you the hope of glory.

            (1)
          • Ask yourself the question... "in what circumstances would bankruptcy 'not' be acceptable...?

            We can assume that the "intentional forgiveness" designed into the program would do the willful repeat offender no good as he/she is living in repeated willful irresponsibility and will eventually carry the record of repeated bankruptcy on their credit report for life...

            How-ever the insolvent steward whether "intentional or not" who comes to a point of realization of being overburdened with unmanageable debt and "desires" to reform their stewardship but legitimately cannot even apply better money management while under the current situation because they unsuccessfully...

            - tried re-negotiating the loans interest
            - tried negotiating lower payments
            - tried negotiating a single lower lump sum final payout
            - tried consolidation of debts

            When all avenues available are unsuccessful and "basic" needs cannot be met, this serious decision needs to be prayerfully (possibly with friends and fasting) considered...

            REMEMBER...

            When all avenues are exhausted, bankruptcy is an intentionally designed program with intentionally designed forgiveness built in by educated people who "intentionally" designed it that way... no different than biblical cities of refuge, no different than the year of Jubilee and though worldly in policy it was designed to set at Liberty those that are bound that they might be free to both live and contribute as intended... sort of reminds you of a biblical story we are all familiar with....

            _________

            "The Lord has come to me of old, saying, I have called thee with an everlasting love, therefore with tender loving kindness have I drawn thee..."

            When we are at the end of our "self supporting" ability, see that all of our efforts avail nothing and can finally acknowledge our need of a Saviour we heed the call and finally we come to the cross...

            Spiritually, emotionally bankrupt, life in a mess... we come to the cross... our Jesus welcomes us with arms open wide, reveals His wounds and says "...I am the way, the truth and life, come unto me all ye who labor and are heavy laden and I will give you rest..."

            This text speaks directly to the weariness of the battle for the mind, the christian's inner struggle against the old man of sin, the body of death. We ask for forgiveness, for rebuilding and direction, He bids the Father on our behalf "...sanctify them with Thy truth, Thy word is truth..." and points us to His word, read, learn, internalize the word for by beholding we become changed.

            Behold the cross, total absolute forgiveness, behold the year of Jubilee, total absolute forgiveness.

            The bankruptcy program was intentionally designed to help the steward to clean up the past "intentional or unintentional" miss-managed accounts of oversight and accumulated unsupportable debt, or rescue as far as is possible the unfortunate steward who through unforeseen circumstances (ie: medical bills, unemployment...) finds themselves unable to support the debt and life's basic needs.

            It would only be wrong to seek refuge if you did'nt really need it, or if you have'nt learned anything from your current situation.

            This is an "intentionally" written program.... nuf said.

            (1)
  5. Proverbs 37:21 is an eye opener. Those who do not repay are wicked and those who are "righteous sheweth mercy and giveth." Its important for us as Christians to know and remember these Bible truths as there are some of us who can, but do not repay, and do not see any wrong in it. We should have no desire to be labelled as 'wicked'.

    (2)
    • Prov 37:21 is often misquoted by taking it literally as written: the meaning of the statement "...those who do not repay are wicked..." speaks to those who borrow with the intent to take advantage and not repay or return the borrowed item. They put themselves under the law... as showing themselves openly who they are.

      The statement "...those who are righteous sheweth mercy and giveth..." reference those who have understanding of grace and their obligation by repaying/returning as well as extending the same to others, they are able to understand both their obligation and live in harmony with the principles of the year of jubilee.

      ...so much more can be said...

      (1)
  6. Poor selling organs to pay debts.
    Wicked borrows and does not pay back.
    There are two kinds of borrowers.
    One borrows to survive.
    The other borrows to sustain their luxury life.

    There are two kinds of lenders
    One who would lend to make more money
    The other lends to help someone in need.

    One who borrows and have the means to pay back and does not is a thief.
    One who lends and have the means to forgive the debt based on the borrowers financial situation is also wicked.

    Borrower is called to be faithful to their vow
    Lender is called to show mercy

    In a sinful world we cannot have a blanket statement. Each must discern the circumstances.

    (24)
  7. I thinking one spiritual danger would be...not to rely on God for our day to day needs. If we can borrow then we begin to rely on personal abilities, and we are in danger of not letting the gifts from heaven reach us.

    (3)
    • Relying on God does not mean doing nothing. God has given us the ability to research, think, take advice from experts, and make wise decisions. God expects us to use these gifts. If "relying on the Lord" means waiting for someone to come to your financial rescue, that is presumption.

      (3)
  8. Interesting topic and discussions above. I feel this topic has come in handy as debt is prevailing nowadays. The lesson has reminded me of my aunt who was well of and she took care of her siblings making sure they were all taken care of, she always used to say " I was blessed so that I maybe a blessing to others". I wish I could have that spirit of helping and not expect to be paid back. I feel some people take advantage yes they maybe in need but the way they get to spend leaves you broken. For instance you help a family member with money to start a business instead they spend the money on something else and come back to ask for more. How do you discern that I have helped enough, do you continue just giving out?

    (0)
    • Responding to your final two sentences: From my point of view, it looks like you might need to help that person be responsible with money. Giving a large amount to "start a business" after the person spent the previous amount on something else may not be good stewardship.

      In the business world, investing in a business usually results in having some kind of stake in the business - being on the managing board, owning shares, that kind of thing. If you see the possibility of the business succeeding and you can help, why not make some kind of arrangement where you could be part of the decision-making process. Even if you don't actually give any input, it might help the family member make more responsible decisions.

      This is just a personal suggestion. Perhaps others have more suggestions.

      (0)

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