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Friday: Further Thought – Honesty With God — 17 Comments

  1. Today's lesson states that there is a "penalty for failure to keep the covenant" and suggests that Mal 3:9 illustrates this.

    The question I have is this: is Mal 3:9 referring to a curse that has been imposed by God as a 'penalty' because He is 'upset' at being robbed of tithes - or is the 'curse' that Israel was experiencing a natural consequence of their living out of harmony with the only way that life and reality can work?

    Does God impose penalties or is it rather that reality exerts inherent consequences and that God, knowing that reality does this, warns us of how reality works?

    (9)
    • At first and again, tithing was not made for God, but for men. God does not need this blessing, we need it. At the same time that God wants us to value the money we gain He wants to help us to learn to be detached from it!

      Counting my income every month makes me aware of God's blessings! Even if it's little! "Faithful in little, faithful in much!"

      Are we really ready to give all our lives to God as a "sacrifice"? When He already owns everything? We are the ones to learn how to give! We are the ones to receive these blessings! When should we be afraid of curses? When we do not know God.

      (14)
      • Yes we ought to sacrifice all on the altar but note he also says he'd rather have obedience than sacrifice. I personally don't see tithing, no matter the income, as sacrifice. If we are truly honest then it can't be a sacrifice as it's not ours to begin with. Just like how we understand that we have to give Uncle Sam his, we must understand that we can't keep the Lord's.

        (3)
    • I believe it is a matter of consequence not to "take sides with God" so to speak but it is not his nature to delight in hurting people. If you have unprotected sex you run the risk of getting pregnant. You plant a seed a tree might grow you steal and act selfishly you mar your character commits a sin and run the risk of being unhappy or even not making it home

      (3)
    • Also if we notice the focus is not on the curse so to speak but on the blessing it's just that the harsh reality if it is that there is another side if we don't chose the blessing

      (4)
    • Phil, any "curse" foretold by God is merely a warning of what we would bring upon ourselves in a world filled with wickedness on every side, if we break off from God's covenant and His promised protections and blessings.

      Any refusal to love the Lord supremely is to reject His sovereignty over us and is nothing less than stating we will be our own god. We need only do this on one point, where His will is clear to us, but we prefer our own will instead. Any willful disobedience is saying to God: "Leave me alone! I can manage myself."
      How often do sinners look at disobedience in this manner? It is the spirit of satan who placed himself above God.

      (1)
  2. In answering the question how to help someone who thinks they can't afford to pay tithe. First thing is to get them in some practical way to understand it's not theirs to begin with, and you don't pay tithe you return it. Use of those words are critical. If u have you a hundred bucks to take to the bank, ten dollars to go on my account, ninety am giving you, you don't have a hundred dollars. So if you decide to give your friend some money, you can only give away ninety of the hundred because ten is not yours

    (1)
  3. This issue of honesty really runs deep. I think the concept of the purpose of tithing is similar to health reform. It's the discipline intended and the character building. We have to see beyond the act.

    (2)
  4. I always ponder that same question. It seems at odds with God's character to intentional cause suffering when His expressed desire is to provide and protect and offer us a life that is at peace with Him. But, like a wise parent, he knows the consequences of living selfishly and perhaps he does decide to orchestrate events to draw us back to the reality that He is in control. I do not know...

    (1)
    • ppake

      I would like to encourage you that you are on the right track with your thinking. I would only add to your last thought that its not so much that God is trying to draw us back to the reality that He is in control, but that He is trying to draw us back to the reality that there is only one way that abundant life/reality (Jn 10:10) can and does work.

      As Deut 30:15-20 and 2 Pet 3:9 summarises, God only desires that we would choose life and therefore does everything He can to give us every opportunity to do so through whatever loving way possible.

      (1)
  5. Am sorry but one more comment :). Was just reading counsel on stewardship pg 77. She mentions how we not only rob God but our brethren. Not just tithe but our offering are God's bank account for helping less fortunate and sharing the gospel this is critical. This motivates me when i lay in my bed and my belly is full to think because of my dishonesty someone may be hungry. Now in light of this I also want to ask how do you motivate someone who believes the conference is not being responsible and they would prefer to send their tithes directly to missionaries or use it to help people to make sure it is being used for God

    (0)
    • In regard to your question about how to 'motivate' someone who believes tithe is not being used responsibly, I would propose asking that person whether they have attempted to discuss their concerns with the conference. If they have not, doing so might be an opportunity for positive change. If they have done so and no change has occurred, then giving tithe directly to the 'frontline' may well be the only other option.

      (0)
    • Do you recall the story where Jesus, sitting in the temple, observed the giving of offerings by the worshipers? He blessed the widow for giving all her means to what was a corrupt treasury. She wasn't giving to the corruption, but to God. It was the only means to do so, the only "treasury" God recognized.

      God can do anything and will take those sincere tithes/offerings and use them according to His will. Give to HIM, and let Him be the Sovereign, regardless of what men may do.

      If you pray and the Lord leads you on another path, follow it faithfully. Only be sure it is HE who leads you.

      (0)
  6. Why is return of tithe and offerings such an important act? Q: You ask how do we return to God? A: Concurrently with rekindling a relationship with God, we start returning one tenth of our profits to God. It goes back to Love and Duty that our parents taught us. Malachi 3:7. I have found that living justly, doing right, and walking humbly with my Lord, nulifys curses and, removes the robber status,

    (3)
    • In Hope Sabbath School (http://hopess.hopetv.org/) a comment was made that I really liked.

      Not returning tithe robs God, not of money He needs, but of His opportunity to bless us (Malachi 3:10-12).

      (2)
      • When the curses are removed and the robber status fades, because you are now returning on your increase, Heaven opens the store house of blessing. “Therefore the LORD waits [expectantly] and longs to be gracious to you, And therefore He waits on high to have compassion on you. For the LORD is a God of justice; Blessed (happy, fortunate) are all those who long for Him [since He will never fail them].”
        ‭‭ISAIAH‬ ‭30:18‬ ‭AMP‬‬
        We long for Him enough, we will be faithful. What kept Abraham faithful. He longed for Him. And knew if he did, God would never fail him. Love and duty they are twins that even Dr. Carson cannot separate.

        (0)
  7. Many fail to understand the fragility of their material wellbeing. We fail to understand the blessings of gainful employment, good health and loving relationships until circumstance rips them from us. A couple my wife and I knew had a devastating financial event in their lives. They said nothing to anyone, but finally noting that lights did not come on in their house when it was dark and no exhaust came from their chimney even though it was below zero Celsius, told the story. They had just enough to pay for some food from a meager income, but hardly more.

    What words would you have for someone who says, “I just can’t afford to tithe”? How do you help a person who sees himself or herself in this situation? And, besides words, what else might be done to help?

    When someone has barely enough to eat, I have nothing to say about tithe. I called the power and gas utilities, and they were kind enough to give me an idea of the arrears. My wife and I sent the cheques to cover that plus enough for several more months.

    What marvelous Joy to see the lights come on and to know that our neighbours were finally warm after months of privation!  What a blessing to have this happy secret in our hearts!  I think that is how God must feel when his Blessing to each us is returned as a blessing to others.  Our only regret was that we were not attentive enough (too busy?) to see what was obvious months before.

    (8)

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