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Thursday: Stumbling — 17 Comments

  1. In all honesty, when I was young, it was difficult to share my faith with friends because, it was deemed uncool. But growing up, I feel more confident in my faith and can see what an amazing God we serve. I would like to work with the youth to help them realise at a younger age that we serve a risen saviour that can do amazing things in outlives, especially when we are in our youth.

    (17)
  2. I think that when we get the wrong concept of something we generally do so because of the misjudgement based on wrong preconcepts that we already have! When Jesus is a mere passage that we look at, not an experience that we live, this is easy to happen! While we look for Him somewhere out there, not in our hearts, we will fail! Where is Jesus for me now? Is He part of every single thought? Or I just call upon Him when I feel distressed?

    (15)
    • Those are a good set of thought questions. By the grace of God I desire to refrain from being a stumbling block to Christ working in my life. Called growing in Christ, or santification if you will. One pastor put it this way, the Cross is in front of us, lets not walk over it. David said: I put Christ always before me, its easy, because He is always at my right side. Therefore I am happy. Psalms 16:8-9.
      Be happy JC
      John

      (8)
  3. There are two conflicting ways of understanding the message of the Bible. One is that salvation is achieved. The other is that salvation is received. According to some people, the Christian life is about trying. According to some other people, the Christian life is about trusting.

    It is possible, of course, for a person to emphasize entering into the Lord’s rest--a relationship based on what the Lord has done--as an excuse to not do what that person knows he should do. On the other hand, it is possible for someone else to place so much emphasis on what we should do as to effectively deny that the basis of our salvation is what the Lord has done, what he is doing now and what he will yet do.

    When an English translation of Romans 9 is rendered, “hath not attained to the law of righteousness”, are we to understand the word, “attained”, to mean Israel had not “achieved” righteousness? Is it possible to think that the word, “attained” (as used here or in Ellen White’s writings) should be taken to mean that the Christian life is about trying?

    Please let me suggest reading the passage in Romans 9 again from the perspective that, while it is true that Israel of old didn’t “achieve” righteousness, true righteousness could never be achieved by trying--only by trusting. Abraham believed God and it was counted to him as righteousness. Trying didn’t result in righteousness for the Israelites before Jesus was born and it doesn’t result in righteousness for us today. Conversion results in a change in behavior but a change in behavior isn’t necessarily conversion. Conversion is the miracle whereby a person’s trust is transferred from what he thought he could do to save himself from sin and its consequences to what the Lord has done, what he is doing now and what he will yet do to save us.

    (18)
    • Thanks, Roger. I appreciate your take on Rom 9:30-32.

      And I particularly appreciate your observation that "true righteousness could never be achieved by trying--only by trusting." To enlarge on that, let us consider what it means to trust.

      Jesus taught: "Let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works and glorify your Father in heaven." (Matt 5:16) Thus it seems to me that perfect trust in God will align our lives with the will of the Father and direct all glory to Him. That's because we won't be trusting ourselves and garnering glory to ourselves.

      You note that

      It is possible, of course, for a person to emphasize entering into the Lord’s rest--a relationship based on what the Lord has done--as an excuse to not do what that person knows he should do.

      What Paul wrote should keep us from thinking along those lines: "fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life..." (1 Tim 6:12) So it seems to me that trusting is not a life of passivity, but an active fight to maintain faith - a warring against the self that continually wants to be resurrected. That's why Paul also said, "I die daily." (See 1 Cor 15:31; Gal 2:20)

      Furthermore, "labor therefore to enter into His rest" (Heb 4:11) suggests there is effort involved. We can enter into His rest only by fighting against our natural inclinations in the "fight of faith." I believe that is the same rest that Christ has promised. (Matt 11:29) Christ Himself said, "If anyone would be my disciple, let him take up his cross daily and follow me." (Luke 9:23) So while I believe that salvation is not achieved, but received (good wording), there is a price to pay, and the price is all of ourselves. That's the paradox of the salvation so freely offered: There is nothing we can offer to purchase it; yet it costs us everything, as Christ demonstrated by the parable of the treasure hid in a field.

      However, I think many of us forget what the fight is all about. It is not about achieving our salvation. Christ has already done that. It is all about trusting Him who is our salvation, and that is far from easy, because we all naturally want to take some of the credit for the "sacrifice" we are making.

      A more contemporary author put it this way:

      "The Christian life is a battle and a march. But the victory to be gained is not won by human power. The field of conflict is the domain of the heart. The battle which we have to fight - the greatest battle that was ever fought by man - is the surrender of self to the will of God, the yielding of the heart to the sovereignty of love. The old nature, born of blood and of the will of the flesh, cannot inherit the kingdom of God. The hereditary tendencies, the former habits, must be given up." Ellen White, Thoughts from the Mount of Blessings, p. 141.

      (Clicking on the link above allows you to see the context. It's worth reading.)

      Your thoughts?

      [Disclosure: If this comment does not sound quite like me, it is because this comment is patterned after another comment submitted for publication but rejected for being too argumentative.]

      (5)
    • I believe that is the point Paul is making. Sort of a play on words. The Jews did not attain . . . because they tried. The Gentiles attained--they didn't try. They attained by faith. One can never attain by trying.

      (2)
  4. It’s easy to find ones self in a tight situation and find that the stumbling block is in our faith. It’s because somethings we enjoyed doing contradict with our faith and thus we find ourselves in a position that we can only see Jesus as a stumbling block instead of a rock of salvation. If we commit ourselves fully to Christ we will see Him as the rock of salvation.

    (18)
    • Wow, this shows how words can have different meanings. The Bible talks about the faith or faithfulness of Christ. It also talks about our faith or belief in Christ. Here the term faith refers to a denomination or a set of beliefs. We always have to make sure we understand how a word is being used. To use a Bible text about faith and apply it to the meaning of a set of doctrines could lead to some non-Biblical conclusions.

      (2)
  5. What are the words to use to differentiate between choosing Jesus to motivate our thoughts and feelings and choosing a drink or a shoe style?

    It seems that we get off track when we talk about choosing anything but Jesus in our lives. Legalism comes from focusing on choices other than Jesus. Choosing Jesus is one thing but choosing a car or a food to eat is quite another type of choice, but all choices we must make seem to be integrated into our salvation.

    Where is the focus of the true child of God in all the choices that we make in life?

    (3)
  6. If Jesus and the law are one and the same, then the law is never a stumblingblock for me and therefore neither is Jesus. But sometimes The Holy Spirit tells me that even though I did not break the law, I did something that Jesus would never have done and that therefore I need to do what it says in 1 John 1:9 and in Isaiah 1:18 so that after reasoning with God and doing what it says in those two verses of scripture that I can be cleansed from my unrighteousness and my sins can be as wool and as white as snow.

    (2)
    • The (dormal written) law was given to help sinful humans know the true meaning of love. Love is the foundation of God's government and (as the Bible states) the fulfillment of the law. The law cannot possibly address every situation. That was the point of Christ's sermon on the mount, "you have heard . . . But I say . . .".

      (1)
    • Here is what i want us to just pause and think of.
      Did anyone went through the book of Hebrews 11 and read it all. Faith is not a choice. Faith is born out of believing. If you believe then you will have faith. You can never keep even the simplest law if you don't believe. Stumbling is cause by not believing. Faith are thing we never see and law is action. You have believe to come up with some positive actions. Your actions proves your beliefs. Faith also shapes your daily life. We go to bed by faith that tomorrow i will wake up. We live faith daily. We board aircrafts going anywhere with faith sure we will get to our final destination. Faith is having Hope. To obey laws is to first have faith. Also you can choose to obey the law or not by you not chose to have faith. Faith is "spiritual" faith is not shelved such you can pick it No. You can chose to keep a law but not believing it or not understanding why you keep it. All these are controlled by love. In everything they ought to be some love driving behind. If we build on love there will never be stumbling in our life.

      (2)
      • No. But the best part of the book of Hebrews for me is Heb 10:39. EGW says to "Pray more fervently," and to "Believe more fully," and to "try again with more steadfastness to grow into the likeness of our Lord." So, we do not draw back into perdition but we "believe" to the saving of our souls.

        (2)
        • Thanks Pete however note that without faith would you pray?. Jesus put an emphasis on praying not having faith because He knows the its faith that will make us pray. To continue praying is faith without faith we can not continue in prayer. Faith is everything.

          (2)
          • The Faith of Jesus is is in the fruit of the Holy Spirit in our lives. He makes the first overture toward us and we have the choice whether to accept it. It seems to me that praying in the Name of Jesus is praying with the motivation of the Holy Spirit as John Bunyan taught.

            God Loved us first and we can respond, but the only time we can respond is NOW. This implies a choice on our part.

            (2)

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