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Tuesday: Correction With Love — 22 Comments

  1. The real test of any discipline theory is dealing with teenager children as they metamorphize from loving children who listen to your every word into young adults eager to test your authority be asserting their independence. It is too late to recite biblical proverbs and Spirit of Prophecy wisdom when you are faced with a raging teenager who wants to go off with his mates to places you do not him to go. Shouts of "I hate you! " and, "You must be the worst parent ever!"; slammed doors and sullen sulky moods that last for days are all part of the scene, even in Christian homes. And just when you have been through it with one teenager the next one starts. If you have the privilege of having children of both sexes then you will know that young women go through the change in an entirely different way, both stressful and challenging.

    What is the best advice that I have ever received about disciplining teenagers?

    Don't react. If you have a confrontation, tell them that we will talk about it later and decide what to do. That also gives you a chance to have a talk to your spouse about it so that you are both on the same page.

    Did I always follow that advice? Well, no, and I lived to regret it. I was a slow learner.

    And now we are just starting the journey again with teenage grandchildren. And while we are not the primary disciplinarians for them the issue still affects us.

    If your children are to survive their teenage years, the best lesson they can ever learn is that no matter what they do, they are still loved by you. That is the lesson that God, the father, has been trying to drum into our thick heads all along. That is something my own parents lived sixty odd years ago when I was a rebellious teenager.

    (39)
    • I know what you mean Maurice. When my daughter was a teenager I wanted to put a cross in front of her and say "Satan be gone!" One day,years later, she was sitting on the couch listening to her little brother talk to me much as she had. She said, "Mom, I want to apologize for everything I ever said to you." That day I knew something I had tried to reach her had gotten through.

      (7)
  2. If we are honest with ourselves, we know that we are not where God wants us to be. He wants us to grow and change and be more tomorrow than we are today. In fact, the Christian life is one of change-extensive, difficult, inner change and growth. This is what the Word of God describes. Paul wrote, ”We all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as from the Lord, the Spirit”(2 Corinthians 3:18). This transformation requires knowledge and requires change. Do you welcome such transformation?

    The apostle also wrote, ”Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, so that you may prove what the will of God is, that which is good and acceptable and perfect”” (Romans 12:2). Are we seeking to be transformed by the renewing of our mind? This too requires learning, knowledge, and change. Peter admonishes us: ”Grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ”” (2 Peter 3:18). Are we actively pursuing this kind of spiritual growth in our life?

    (11)
  3. When is the best time to teach principles to children?
    I would suggest:
    - when they are suggestible between 1-7 years
    - when they are being good
    - when they are seeking parental approval

    As they get older correction, discipline should be to remind them of the principles and to teach then consequences, not to punish them.
    I learnt that hitting a child seldom accomplishes true correction, in fact I believe it is a lazy response, it takes more time and effort and consistence to teach the intended lesson.

    Correction should be done calmly in a well considered manner.
    If we react in anger we are teaching the child the worst lesson in life, we see this so often now days, for example what is called "road rage" beating a stranger for annoying him or infringing his 'rights'.

    It is so sad that many young parents didn't have a good example growing up, where can they get good advice before it is too late?

    (6)
    • 1. Correction is one thing and punishment is another and both have their purpose - you correct one who didn't truly understand but you must punish the one who knew they were doing something wrong and did it anyhow.

      2. Correction should always be appropriate - a bandage for small cuts and a tourniquet for major ones. Too little may not be effective and too much can make things worst.

      3. You are right about being calm as long as you are not saying we must not apply appropriate stern disciple if/as required.

      4. Most people have the benefit of seeing more than just their parent in action and they have the opportunity to do what seems like the better way. No doubt it is better to have "good" parents but it is not required that children repeat bad examples.

      (1)
  4. To have a kid is a great experience. But it takes a lot of responsability! It is not such an easy task, but it is certainly unforgetable. Good and bad character traits may be passed along to the next generation. That's why, as parents, it is necessary to live as fully dedicated to growth and be better! (In the journey to heaven there is not much of laybacks, anyway!)
    Being a good parent does not mean to be perfect, it means to work a lot on self too. It means to recognize our own weaknesses and search for wisdom from above. Whatever we cannot see as wrong within ourselves we will not be able to see clearly in our sons and daughters. Still, with all our limitations, the way to go is to be founded on the true fountain of love, which is God! While the most impressive demonstration of His love is related to parenthood! Who of us would be strong enough to give a perfect son's life for other (mad) one?

    (2)
  5. When, where and how can we draw a line between discipline and punishment?

    The civil laws of this day and age criminalizes the use of "the rod" or any seemingly harsh method of child discipline. In the light of today's lesson especially Prov. 23:13 & 14, how can we obey God and at the same time not break the laws of the day?

    (2)
    • While not defending the use of corporal punishment, I have seen it replaced by equally damaging other strategies such as deprivation and isolation that are just as damaging to the mind of a child. I grew up in an era where the cane was used as punishment in school (and yes I was punished a couple of times). The punishment was over quickly and while it hurt at the time, generally there were no hard feelings and we got on with the job of learning. Deprivation and isolation strategies last a lot longer and cause bitter resentment. The real problem is that discipline is often a reactive spur of the moment decision rather than a carefully thought through strategy designed to grow and develop the child. Phew, I wish I had taken my own advice!

      (7)
    • When the laws of the land are in apparent contradiction to the word of God, we have a choice to make.

      That said, it is certainly not in the best interests of children to jeopardize their living as members of the family. In other words, we must necessarily avoid running afoul of Child Protective Services in countries with such laws.

      Such laws were likely enacted in good faith because of the damage done by abusive parents who beat their children in anger. That is not discipline. That truly is abuse. No godly punishment is ever done in anger, but prayerfully, keeping the eternal welfare of the child in mind.

      Here's my personal take on the situation: Corporal punishment (usually administered to a child's bottom) should be large confined to the first three years of life when immediate feedback is important and many other methods are merely counter-productive. (If done within the privacy of the family, there's no way for the government to interfere.) If a child is faithfully disciplined during the first three years, the need for corporal punishment will be greatly reduced in later years.

      Children should not be punished for accidental damage to valuable property. Nor should they be punished for inadvertently embarrassing or angering their parents. They need to be taught to obey their parents because parents are in the place of God to them. And parents need to model the loving character of God. But willful disobedience does need to be treated seriously, whether it is in a minor or major matter. (I believe too many parents do not realize this but punish in proportion to how much the child's behavior inconveniences them. That is not biblical.)

      If parents keep their children close to them (and I don't mean in isolation), corporal punishment may still be helpful up to the age of 6 or so. After that, parents need to prayerfully devise creative and appropriate consequences for disobedience. As Maurice mentioned, alternative punishments may at times be even more damaging than a switch to the bottom or a slap on an offending hand.

      Here's a true story that should offer food for thought:

      I taught in a Christian school for another denomination. We had an outstanding Grade 1 teacher who seldom, if ever, had any disciplinary problems she could not handle on her own. But there was one exception, when Nathan (not necessarily his name) came into her classroom. He would not listen to her, no matter what creative strategies she used to help him comply. His behavior was disruptive in her classroom. She finally called on the principal to help. Independent schools in British Columbia still had the right to use corporal punishment, so she was asking the principal to use "the strap" on the child.

      I found out about this incident when I happened to stop by at the administrative office adjoining the principal's office. A woman was sitting by the principal's door, sobbing in obvious distress.

      Later, I found out that her child was being dealt with inside that office. (When contacted, the parents said they had *never* "laid hands on" their child, and they were not about to agree to the principal doing so. However, given the choice between withdrawing their son from our school or permitting the strapping, they reluctantly agreed to the latter.)

      The principal's usual way of administering the strap was three swats across an outstretched hand. However, the boy screamed defiance after the first two swats, so he got two swats extra, making a total of 5 swats with the strap.

      After that, the child appeared to be transformed into a well-behaved normal boy in the classroom, cooperating as well as the others. For the rest of the year, there was no reason to discipline him.

      But what really got my attention was that the parents who had been at their wits' ends trying to deal with their son's rebellious behavior at home reported that his behavior at home at also changed dramatically. He became quite well-behaved, and they were really enjoying the change.

      In thinking about this apparently sudden transformation, here are my thoughts:

      • Children appreciate structure and boundaries. It makes them feel safe.
      • Lack of boundaries can make them feel unsafe and uncared for, leading the disruptive behavior.
      • This boy ruled his parents in the home. There was no higher authority, and it scared him. Thus his disruptive behavior.
      • Running up against clear boundaries at school helped him realize that he was not in charge of the whole world - that there were other people in charge. So he no longer had the weight of the world on his shoulders, relieving a lot of stress. (This is somewhat figurative, but I hope you catch the idea.)

      The lesson from this little true story is that sometimes "the rod" is precisely what is needed. I can't think of anything else that would have produced the desired results in this situation. However, at this age and older, children should know the consequences of telling what goes on in the family. They should be taught that family things stay in the family. (I know this has been abused in abusive families, but just because a principle has been abused doesn't make the principle wrong.)

      (7)
      • "Children should not be punished for accidental damage to valuable property. Nor should they be punished for inadvertently embarrassing or angering their parents."

        This is true. Nevertheless, these situations are an opportunity for a child to learn to constructively act in situations where he has inadvertently caused loss and hurt to another person. Insofar as practical in the context of the age and maturity of the child, the parent needs to explain the loss or hurt to the child and then work with the child to clean up the mess and provide some form of restitution. Children early develop a strong sense of fairness, and once they understand what has happened, will work to try and make the situation right.

        (2)
        • Thanks, Richard. I agree totally. My emphasis was on no "punishment" for accidental transgressions. That doesn't mean we don't teach children that their behavior was inapppropriate. *After* teaching children explicitly what to do and not to do, transgressions can be dealt with as disobedience. That said, parents need to make sure that children clearly understand what is expected of them before treating behavior as disobedience.

          (2)
  6. this lesson mischaracterizes discipline of children. Use of the rod does not permit physical abuse of children or anyone for any reason. However, being stern and rigid in disciplinary measures is taught. Proverbs teaches that discipline should be firm and fair, not flexible and friendly.

    (3)
  7. Do parental beatings with a rod really "lead children to God" and "guide their children's footsteps to Christ?"

    I would suggest that purposefully hurting our children does no such thing. Moreover, if we cite the Bible as justification for inflicting pain on our children, where do we stop?

    What about Deuteronomy 21:18-21; Exodus 21:15; Leviticus 20:9?

    (6)
    • How do you think Jesus would respond to the verses Deuteronomy 21:18-21; Exodus 21:15; Leviticus 20:9?
      Read also Matthew 19:3-9 to see to He would most-likely respond.

      Note that the bible recommends the use of the rod for discipline and not for punishment or abuse (There is a difference which is evident in the proportion and motive). Prov. 22:15 And this measures should be taken very early in life (Between ages 3 and 6, as Inge Anderson recommended) and very sparingly too.

      (1)
      • I think Jesus would say "Be merciful, even as your Father is merciful." (Luke 6:36)

        As we studied last quarter, hearts are not drawn to God by way of force.

        (0)
        • Yes, very correct like He was merciful to the adulterous woman and changed her life forever. However, when dealing with little children, they might misunderstand such show of mercy and think they are being condoned which is very dangerous. I am not advocating for corporal punishment, am only saying that there is need for appropriate discipline to be meted out on children and that the use of "the rod" should be reserved as last resort when all other measures have failed, out of love and not hatred or anger Prov. 3:11-12.
          The use of "the rod" becomes abuse when:
          1. The motive is wrong (out of anger,hatred or mischief).
          2. The pain inflicted is out of proportion.
          3. There are better methods of discipline that are yet to be exploited.

          (1)
          • And I think it is worth remembering that there are ways of punishing a child that inflict more damage than corporal punishment. Taunting, embarrassing children in front of their peers, deprivation, isolation from family, can and are all be used abusively. There are two principles that are worth remembering:

            1) Discipline/punishment is too important to be left to spur of the moment decisions. Think and plan strategically.
            2) Whatever discipline/punishment is used, the child must be in no doubt that they are still loved.

            (7)
  8. Struggling with the issue of a correcting rod in education, I came across Proverbs 10:13 discovering a possible symbolic usage of the rod as instrument of correction. It reads like this: "In the lips of him that has understanding, wisdom is found and a rod for the back of him lacking understanding." I am using the Waw as usual in the sense of "and", not antithetical as "but". This means, that the words of the wise serve as a rod of redemptive correction. Wise words are the vehicle of education. The Septuagint, more freely translating, has it like this: "He who pronounces wisdom from his lips, with a rod he smites the heartless one."

    On the other hand, I am trying to understand the non symbolic usage of "rod", considering the introduction of the book of proverbs, warning the youth of being led into a blood shedding criminal band of robbers. (Proverbs 1:10-14) If such a connection exists, what instrument of correction sould be used? Does God prevent using the ultimate means of correction, if all Scripture is given by inspiration of God? (2 Timothy 3:16) In the end, if parents have not done everything to counteract things like these, I think, the state will take over a much more severe punishment. Or else, life itself will bring about such punishment, however not without hope of redemptive correction.

    Winfried Stolpmann

    (4)
  9. A few brief principles to add to the valuable input already provided on this topic:

    1. The aim of discipline is to foster development of a child’s/person’s capacity for healthy self-discipline. True discipline is therefore other-centered and in the best interests of the other (rather than your best interests).

    2. Healthy self-discipline involves awareness and acceptance of the reality (and therefore the responsibility) that my ‘actions’ have consequences to myself and to others.

    3. The best way I will learn this is by repeatedly and consistently experiencing the consequences of my actions. Natural consequences teach me this more powerfully than ‘artificial’ consequences. However, there are many instances where natural consequences are too unsafe, too inappropriate or too far away and therefore ‘artificial’ consequences are instead necessary. Yet even ‘artificial’ consequences need to be as close to natural as is appropriate to the context. This can take quite some effort to identify.

    4. According to dictionary definitions, the term ‘punishment’ can refer to experiencing the ‘natural’ consequences arising from - or it can refer to an imposed retribution. Technically, retribution can refer to enabling as close to natural consequences as possible (and appropriate) to be experienced where pure natural consequences are not accessible or appropriate. However, in practice, unfortunately retribution frequently is motivated by a desire to ‘get even’, ‘get back at’, or ‘make them pay’. Hence it is vitally important to consider the motivation underpinning an imposed punishment.

    5. Discipline takes place within the context of your overall relationship with the child/person. Where the child/person experiences that you genuinely care about them, discipline is more likely to be perceived as redemptive and restorative. Where this is not the case, there is a much greater risk that your actions will be perceived negatively - that you are against them as a person. And this typically fosters development of a hostile response or disposition.

    I would propose that Paul had these above principles/awarenesses in mind when writing Eph 6:4.

    (1)

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