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Tuesday: The Resurrection — 20 Comments

  1. It is possible to read the Old Testament and not believe in the resurrection. The Sadducees of Jesus time are a testament to that. My understanding is that they applied those passages that we thing apply to the resurrection to the reinstatement of the Kindom of Israel. Both the major branches of Jewish thought describe the Messiah as the one who releases the Jewish nation from oppression and missed the notion that the Messiah was coming to save everyone and not just the Jewish nation.

    It is easy for us to criticise them from our viewpoint but it should be remembered that just because the Jews in ancient times had a blinkered vision, it is quite possible that we do not have the full picture either. It is interesting to read modern metaphysicists discussing the meaning of existence. While most of them accept a purely physical existence, a chemical reaction that at death simply stops functioning, they also think of the possibility of our existence beyond the chemistry. It is impossible to describe some of their thoughts here as it requires a fair bit of scientific understanding to explain it. Suffice it to say that some of their hypotheses are quite challenging and not outside the realm of the things we discuss when we talk about resurrection and eternal life.

    It is worth rereading the last chapter of Daniel from two perspectives. Our own current perspective of course; but also from the perspective of a Jewish reader in the intertestamental and New Testament periods. I know that the book was sealed until "the time of the end", but did any Jews, think they were living in "the time of the end".

    Just a little bit of encouragement to take the time to read Daniel 12 in its entirety and think about the picture that it presents.

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    • Although I prefer the SDA interpretation of the “State of the Dead” , the “dead no not anything” and one awaits resurrection after death, the interpretation of many Jews is that the dead are “ gathered unto their people” (Gen 35:29 & 49:29), strikes me as a reasonable conclusion based on the many text in the Old Testament that use this phrase ( these are just two of many examples).

      Can anyone shed any light on the Old Testament verses that use this phrase?

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      • Hello Mr. Williams,

        My wife, son and I went to the “Holy Land” over a decade ago and our Jewish guide explained the phrase "gathered to his people" this way. In ancient times, a family would make or buy a burial cave (see for example Genesis 23, when Abraham buried Sarah). In the cave, one or more “beds” would be hewn into the stone. Also in the cave would be a container place for bones.

        When a family member died, they would be placed on one of the beds. Over time, their body would decay, leaving only the bones. These bones would then be gathered and placed in the container in cave with the bones of those in the family who had died previously, the “bed” would be ready for the next person in the family who died. This is how a person was “gathered to his [or her] people”. Note Israel’s (Jacob’s) instructions to his sons:

        And he charged them and said to them, I am to be gathered to my people. Bury me with my fathers in the cave that is in the field of Ephron the Hittite, in the cave that is in the field of Machpelah, which is before Mamre, in the land of Canaan, the field which Abraham bought from Ephron the Hittite for a burying-place. They buried Abraham and his wife Sarah there, and they buried Isaac and his wife Rebekah. And I buried Leah there; the purchase of the field and the cave in it, from the sons of Heth. [Genesis 49:29-32 MKJV, emphasis supplied.]

        Israel was literally gathered to his people in that cave at Mamre in the land of Canaan. "Bury me with my fathers in the cave" obviously does not mean he went to heaven to live with his fathers.

        Hope this helps to clarify this biblical expression. A person needs to be careful to keep his preconceptions from making the plain words of the Bible say something that was never intended by the those who wrote those words.

        Richard Ferguson

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        • Thank you for that. It sounds reasonable and plausible.

          I finished reading the Second of two commentaries on Exodus and Genesis written by Dennis Praeger who you may know, is a radio talk show host and a very scholarly Jew. It is his opinion that there is an immediate after life. I do not share his opinion but I did find his exegesis of the text very thorough.

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    • [Moderator's note: This comment had ended up in the Spam folder and was found when it was checked. Aplogoies for the delay in posting.]

      Maurice, I am reading through the Great Controversy again this year and I read the chapter Light through Darkness today. It helped me to further grasp what you have been saying about we Adventists trusting too much in what we have been taught in the past and not being open to seeing things from a different perspective in God's Word. Ellen White talks about the parallel between the disciples and the Early Adventists believing the popular errors in the church of their time and misappropriating the meanings of certain prophecies. She calls them "popular errors that blinded the mind to the truth" (GC, p.352). "Yet God accomplished His own beneficent purpose in permitting the warning of the judgement to be given just as it was... The disappointment also, though the result of their own misapprehension of the message which they gave, was to be overruled for good... To the children of faith the perplexity and sorrow resulting from their error would work the needed correction. They would be led to a closer study of the prophetic word. They would be taught to examine more carefully the foundation of their faith, and to reject everything, however widely accepted by the Christian world, that was not founded upon the Scriptures of truth" (Ibid). Our minds now need to be open to the moving of the Holy Spirit as we study Line upon Line, Precept upon Precept discovering the truths for this time. We are so blessed to have all God's Word opened for our study at this time in history. Things that were meant for the end of time, things that the Disciples could not have understood, things that Daniel and the prophets could not understand because they were not for their time, but for ours. Our job is as Ellen White says to discern our true spiritual state and to seek the Lord with repentance and humility. We are living in stupendous times and we have nothing to fear when we allow His love and light to fill and surround us, then we have what we need to give away. Always trusting that He can fill us again. "Each has his part to act; to each is granted a measure of light, adapted to the necessities of his time, and sufficient to enable him to perform the work which God has given him to do"(GC, p.343).
      Thank you for always encouraging us to look deeper, to study more, that is what the Founding Fathers of our church did and God prepared them to give the message for their time a certain sound, He will do the same for our time. Preparing us to give the final call to this fallen world in mercy & love. Jesus is coming soon.

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  2. John 11:25. The power of Jesus.

    While other parts of the Bible talk and explain about coming alive and resurrection, Jesus took the disciples and the others through the process of being sick, death, and dying then the resurrection.

    I love John 11:1-46. These passages/verses take us through the entire process of what happens to someone who believes in God and dies. Sometimes people see death as a bad thing, but to the Christians we cannot die unless it was sanctioned by God. Bible says Rev 14:13 and they rest from their labour and their works follows them. After decaying, then the resurrection. Encourage all to read it.

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    • Thank You Lyn, I read that with new eyes today and it gave me a new perspective enabling me to apply it personally to my own life. God Bless your day. Tammy

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  3. "What importance lies on this life when what really matters is eternity?"
    I'd say ALL importance! Because according to the Bible we will be judged by the choices we make in this life, right? To get to eternity, we need to have the least of opportunities to recognize Jesus as our Savior. This can be done everyday, for those with counciousness about it, or, maybe by luck, but not out of a context, in the last minute of life (if in fact that is possible, but then again, who are we to judge anyone?).
    Look where the world has gotten itself today! The human path disrupts the balance of natural things. Going crazy for money, mankind created a moto of 'always grow', no matter how! We are the ones to blame for our own state! May we recognize that Nature can fight back in ways that no government can be prepared for. But there is hope in the love of God for us. Once we understand this, economic exploitation of the "house" (Earth) that were given us freely gets out of focus, and the spreading of counciousness through real love may be more important. Counciousness is to do everything with real love.

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    • Eternity begins here and now with Jesus. And then Jesus Himself said that He came to give us "life" and even "more abundant life," John 10:10. And yes, while this life is nothing compared to eternity; Jesus, His Promises, His word, His Holy Spirit, the Fruit of His Spirit, etc. and etc., gives us all we need, even better health than we had before we came to Him, to get along in this world before He returns and makes "All things new."

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    • JC, you stated a very accurate phrase: "... we will be judged by the choices we make".

      Contrary to popular opinion, it is not God that will judge our choices (which if He did would be an arbitrary phenomenon). Rather, it is the choices themselves that will 'judge' us - cause and effect, non-arbitrary phenomenon.

      Put simply, make choices in harmony with the Kingdom of God and the 'judged'/inherent outcome will be abundant life. Make choices in harmony with the Kingdom of Darkness and the 'judged'/inherent outcome will be self-destruction/perishing.

      In our world, 'judgment' is an arbitrary phenomenon. In God's Kingdom reality, judgment is the natural/inherent outcome of cause and effect.

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      • Phil, I don't I understand how you can say that God's judgment is arbitrary. The way I understand the Bible is that He looks at a persons heart and pronounces what He sees there i.e. either that the person has chosen the Kingdom of God or rejected it and then He gives them eternal life or disconnects them from His power of life according to their choices. This is God's judgment which is based on fact and thus is not arbitrary.

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        • Thanks Shirley

          To clarify - as my brief response to JC appears to have left some ambiguity.

          I absolutely agree with you that God’s judgement is non-arbitrary and because of that, God’s judgement is not what it has traditionally/typically been portrayed as. That was the essence of my reply to JC.

          Are you sure God disconnects people from His power of life? Isn’t it the underlying heart orientation and the associated choices that people make the 'thing' that actually disconnects them from His power of life? If so, God is merely releasing the person to that disconnection via ceasing to restrain them from doing so as opposed to being the cause and source of the disconnection. I believe this is reflected in the 1SM 235.2 quote I have posted recently: “By choosing to sin, men separate themselves from God and the sure result is ruin and death”.

          Your thoughts?

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          • Phil, as I understand the Word of the LORD He is decides who will receive eternal life and who will not - it is His sovereign right. God separated Adam and Eve from the Tree of life so they would not live forever.
            An example of where I get my understanding 1Cor 3:17 "... you are the temple of God, and if anyone defiles the temple of God, God will destroy him." It doesn't say they will destroy themselves or some nebulous power (sin or lawlessness) will destroy them. Another example is Sodom and Gomorrah there was no natural consequence that destroyed them, fire and brimstone was rained down on them from heaven and burned them up, just like it will at the end Rev 20:9.
            Another passage is 2Thess 1:5-9 judgement/vengeance on those who do not know God and those who do not obey the gospel of Jesus, they will be punished with everlasting destruction by separation from the presence of God.
            Also the most well known verse John 3:16 in love God gives people the choice to believe in His Son and have everlasting life or perish.
            So yes I understand the Word of the LORD says He either gives eternal life or withdraws the temporary life given through the probationary time.

            But back to the original discussion on your statement that God's judgment is arbitrary, which you then withdrew and said you didn't mean that, but that you took issue with what people understood by judgment. Do you make such controversial statements to provoke thought and discussion? I am concerned that some might take them at face value and be mislead. Would it not be better to be clear, say according to the Bible how does God judge everyone? Then we could go to the text that God looks on the heart 1Sam 16:7 or each ones work will be revealed on that Day 1Cor 3:13 or as you quoted 1Cor 4:4-5 which says the LORD judges by bringing to light the hidden things of darkness and revealing the counsels of the heart.

            You are concerned about people bringing preconceived ideas to the interpretation of the Bible and I agree we should be wary of those who state yes this is what the texts says but actually it doesn't really mean that because of my understanding of the character of God (based on isolated texts instead of the whole Bible) it must mean something different and they end up basically rewriting the whole bible.

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          • Thanks Shirley for taking the time to provide further unpacking of some of your perspective/s.

            No, I was not trying to make a controversial statement to provoke - I was merely providing a succinct comment to JC in light of what he had written to see if he was interested in considering a step further along the lines of a comment he had made.

            With regard to the issue of bible interpretation and whether the bible is being rewritten (this is a huge topic and well beyond the scope of a brief reply here), I guess there will be more to say on this topic next quarter. As you have noted in your comment on March 30, revelation is progressive and our Spirit-guided capacity to more and more accurately comprehend, understand and therefore interpret is also progressive. There is strong scriptural precedent for this. This issue is but one in the overall matrix of issues related to bible interpretation, but it is a significant one and one which I will no doubt comment further on in next quarter's lesson as appropriate.

            You and I see some things in common - such as the some aspects of the concept of Principles of Love and Life - and other things very differently. I am not trying to convert you to my way of thinking but merely to offer what I understand and the basis for that understanding - as you have done in your response above. While we have our differences, I know that you are just as committed to searching out and living according to God's Truth as I am. And along the way I will be challenged by your views to re-examine what I see to see if there is something I am overlooking, so that is a good thing. As Inge and I understand, iron sharpens iron.

            God bless you until our paths next intersect...

            Phil

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      • Phil, I agree with what I think you mean - that God does is not an arbitrary judge - but I think your wording appears to contradict the biblical text. The Bible repeatedly refers to God judging the world. But, as you say, this judgment is not arbitrary, it is simply a matter of allowing people to experience the consequence of their choices. Those who choose the way of Christ, the Lifegiver, will experience everlasting life. Those who choose the way of Satan, the rebel against God's government, will experience eternal death, because separation from the Lifegiver naturally results in death.
        The judgment does not happen without God. He is sovereign now, and He remains sovereign in the judgment.

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        • Thanks Inge

          With regard to whether my wording contradicts the biblical text, it depends on how the word/concept of judgment is interpreted. Is judgment being used in the sense of God making a determination that otherwise wouldn’t or doesn’t exist until that determination is made? Or is God merely revealing and announcing/declaring what already is - like the way a physician would diagnose and prognose? I now believe the biblical text consistently supports the latter view as per 1 Corinthians 4:5 and John 3:18-21 as example texts rather than proof texts.

          This issue illustrates the role of identification, examination and discussion of presuppositions as one of a range of vital components of biblical interpretation - which hopefully will be explored more in next quarter's lesson.

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  4. I am wondering about the meaning of "time of the end." Does it always refers to the time preceding the return of Jesus?

    What about the "end of the indignation?" Could it be that sometimes it refers to times preceding God's great acts in the history of mankind? Times preceding God's miraculous intervention on behalf of his people?

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    • The last book of the Bible, "Revelation," is more the book for God's end time people than the book of Daniel. And while the book of Daniel does have prophecies that apply to the "Time of the end," it is the book of Revelation that reveals the mysteries more clearly for the time of the end for God's end time people. And Jesus promised His Holy Spirit to help us understand this book and to get us through what is coming, Luke 11:13 and many other places in His Word.

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  5. I'm not so clear about the general resurrection that will take place at the second coming of Jesus and the special resurrection of those who crucified Jesus (Dan. 12:2; Matt. 26:63, 64; Rev. 1:7)

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  6. The "time of the end" marks the period that runs from 1844 to the second advent.

    The "end of time" must the time of the termination of the investigation period, just before the time of the beginning of the probationary period.

    Now, "the time of trouble" is the time upon which the probation begins. The period will last for a period of "three-and-a-half" prophetic years/period. Its end comes with the close of the door of mercy.

    The "time of Jacob's trouble" will be the next period of intensive trouble. It will also take another three-and-a-half prophetic years of a more intensive trouble than the earlier half.

    My take.

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